[Novalug] Old Vs New was: Re: Kernel configuration for optical drive.
jecottrell3 at comcast.net
jecottrell3 at comcast.net
Fri Mar 19 17:30:06 EDT 2010
I agree almost entirely in Spirit and Principle with Maxwell. And yet I sympathize with Alan's complaints. Unfortunately, he undercuts his arguments by resorting to namecalling and profanity.
Too many Changes too quickly lead to Future Shock.
I thought of another way to look at it. Linux is simply not as Agile as it once was. Neither is Java, and things like Ruby are springing up in its place. Of course, the barriers to OS Adoption are a lot higher than with Language Adoption, but some part of me wishes there was some Lucy somewhere experimenting with Plan 9 or BeOS or something else in the same way that Linus did with Minix.
Remember that my original comments were about the dearth of good documentation, specifically on udev. After a bit of Googling, I'm forced to retract that. I was perhaps depending too much on the manpages for my enlightenment, a strategy that is increasingly insufficient.
However, while burying one's head in the sand and wishing for the Good Old Days is a suboptimal strategy, blindly accepting everything that comes down the pike isn't the answer either. One must also have some Taste.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Maxwell Spangler" <maxlists at maxwellspangler.com>
To: "Ed James" <edjames at greenbelt.com>
Cc: novalug at calypso.tux.org
Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2010 9:32:22 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
Subject: [Novalug] Old Vs New was: Re: Kernel configuration for optical drive.
On Thu, 2010-03-18 at 15:15 -0400, Ed James wrote:
> There's one big reason I stick with the old stuff - it costs
> money to keep upgrading, especially needlessly. But if there's
> a solid reason to upgrade, I'm all for it. "Namecalling" (I say
> this in a friendly manner) isn't always a proper motivator.
> So, I hereby issue you (and others) a challenge. Gimme reasons
> to upgrade my P-III boxen (and FC4). And please don't take me as
> being arrogant and stuff. I'm looking at this as a friendly
> debate - I have a tremendous amount of respect and admiration for
> this NoVaLUG community. And note that I'm referring to home use.
> For business use, I'll use whatever "they" pay me to use. :P
My problem isn't with anyone, like you, reading this list but using old
software, technologies, training, etc. I believe if you're happy on FC4
and the potential pitfalls haven't impacted you, then continue to enjoy
and master your older environment!
My problem with Alan is that he interrupts the constructive atmosphere
of novalug with tirades against Linux. The tirades tend to be overly
exaggerated nothing more than a rhetorical venting of frustration. If
his skills and expectations are from the days of ISA cards, then he
shouldn't be matching those skills and expectations up to contemporary
versions of Linux. He should either stay on old software or upgrade his
skills and perspective. Complaining with angry comments on a pro-Linux
mailing list isn't constructive in any way. It just makes us defensive
and waste time.
I've enjoyed every of the 21 versions of Linux I've used and I find the
rewards of upgrading to be less than the costs. I get my software for
free, but I pay the price in things that break, things that require my
time to fix, and things that occasionally throw away what I've learned
and forced me to learn something new. The only thing I can say is that
this process has definitely been worth it in the end.
> Quoting "Maxwell Spangler" <maxlists at maxwellspangler.com>:
> > On Wed, 2010-03-17 at 18:14 -0400, Alan Grimes wrote:
> >> What ever happened to the days when if you had an ISA card, you turned
> >> on an ISA driver, if you had a serial port, you loaded a serial driver,
> >> if you had a ATA/IDE hard drive, you loaded an ATA driver, if you had an
> >> ATAPI CD-ROM device, you loaded an ATAPI driver...
> > Referencing the days of ISA cards to attempt to describe the days when
> > things worked normally simply demonstrates that your skills are out of
> > date, your perspective is out of date and you have not made the
> > appropriate investment in learning new things to adapt to the
> > improvements made to Linux.
> > This is more of a personal problem than a Linux problem.
> > It is fascinating to note that in a global sociological point of view
> > many people who are reluctant to adopt, trust or even try new things as
> > the world matures actually become more conservative because of their
> > adversion to change. So here, perhaps, we have an individual example of
> > how the world divides into people who are willing to move forward and
> > people who aren't (but actually end up going in the reverse direction.)
> > Interesting times.
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